Let’s be civil. The Flathead Beacon encourages vigorous discussion and lively debate, but we will delete comments that attack other readers, make accusations we can’t verify, stray too far off topic, criticize local businesses (call them if you have a problem), convict someone of a crime, use profanity or are simply judged to be in bad taste. We don’t always have someone moderating comments, so we ask for your help: If you see a comment that violates these ground rules, or you simply deem it offensive, please e-mail editor [at] flatheadbeacon.com. The views expressed in the comments section do not reflect those of the Beacon.
By More Big Mtn BS on 10-06-07
Thank you Donnie for that botanical gem of a fact.
Most outdoors enthusiasts understand the cyclical nature of the xerophyllum, what we call “beargrass”.
They also probable know that there is no correlation between summer blooms and predicted winter precipitation.
Will the Big Mountain be closing part of the terrain on weekdays as they have in past winters?
Will any work ever be done to complete the poorly finished trail down to Chair 11? How about some other trails down there so it’s not so crowded & dangerous trying to dodge trees and other visitors.
If the upper t-bar runs, will some runs be cut down to Chair 7? We’re still waiting.
You guys are too friendly to the potential real estate shoppers. Is this why the private chair is going in for the giant homes down at Elk Highlands? (They always name it after the game they chase away, this is super funny).
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By Donnie Clapp on 10-10-07
“Donnie Clapp, spokesman for Whitefish Mountain Resort, said the lore on Big Mountain is that when the bear grass blooms heavily on the slopes, a snowy winter is likely to follow.“
I have to point out that I was no way asserting a fact with this statement, nor do I feel that Mr. Testa implied that in his paraphrasing. This is local folklore, no more, no less. I didn’t make it up, I just think it’s kind of cute.
I’ll answer your other questions here, but I don’t intend to argue back and forth beyond this response. Please email me directly at donniec | at | skiwhitefish | dot | com if you’d like to continue the conversation.
First, Hellroaring Basin. Our development in Hellroaring Basin is very limited because it is protected grizzly bear habitat and extensive clear cutting/re-grading was not and probably never will be approved by the Forest Service in that area. I personally support their position. Plus, Hell Fire is probably my favorite groomer on the mountain. I think there are plenty of runs without trees if that’s what you’re looking for.
Second, T-Bar 2, or the upper T-Bar. No, we probably won’t be cutting runs from the T-Bar down to Chair 7. The main purpose of the T-Bar is to facilitate access to undeveloped tree skiing on the backside. The glades back there are wonderful; you should give them a try. As for opening it every day, not this year, but all depends on demand. We tread a fine line, operating as many lifts as we do with as few skiers as we have. It’s wonderful that we’re uncrowded, but that means we have to be frugal with our energy consumption.
Finally, the Elk Highlands Chair (also known as the Home Again Chair). This chair is not private. The actual equipment was purchased by the company that is developing the Elk Highlands subdivision, but they have contracted with WSI (us) to operate and maintain it. Part of that contract states that any guest on the Big Mountain can use the lift and ski the trails that it serves. These trails are probably not worth skiing for pure recreation, but we wrote that into the contract just to make it clear. So, if you want to go ride it, you should.
Anyway, I really hope that this clears up some misconceptions that it seems you have. Again, let me know if there are any other questions I can answer for you.
Thanks,
Donnie Clapp
PR - Whitefish Mountain Resort
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By Still More Big Mtn BS on 10-11-07
Donnie, we’re all anxious to try the glades, but why bother when they are only open on weekends. Have you seen the wild uncontrolled crowds on weekends? We don’t go up there on weekends. There is no speed control other than the occasional ski patroler shouting at snowboarders, it’s just too dangerous up there on weekends.
You guys steal from the skiing public. Make your website say that the place is not entirely open, or offer a weekday rate ticket.
I know you don’t want to discuss this matter here because it exposes the actions of your corporation.
STOP COMMITING FRAUD
Open all of the available terrain.
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By Did Something Get Deleted? on 10-11-07
Didn’t the original post above refer to the injuries which occur on the Hellfire Trail because of the large trees in the trail.
What happened to the reference to being personally sickened by the unnecessary injuries caused by this unfinished trail?
Did you delete the part about seeing tears and the Alert helicopter (air ambulance) down at Chair 11 EVERY SINGLE YEAR.
You hurt visitors there every winter.
BTW, I called the gal at Elk Highlands about the private chair and she said that riders that are not homeowners may be denied boarding. Sounds private to me.
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By Donnie Clapp on 10-11-07
Just a couple of things:
I’m confused. Are you implying that I somehow have the power to delete parts of posts to the comments section of the Flathead Beacon’s website?
Second, “wild uncontrolled crowds”? On the Big Mountain? I have to assume that this is some sort of joke.
Third, if we have ever implied that T-Bar 2 was open when it wasn’t in the past, I’m sorry. I am fairly confident that if that was ever the case, it was due to oversight, not malice. In any event, we are making an effort this year to be very open about which lifts are open. This season’s trail map actually has “does not operate regularly” printed next to the listings for T-Bar 2, Chair 4, and Chair 5, and our website will reflect this as well.
Fourth, if “the gal at Elk Highlands” really said that, she is wrong. Not everyone knows the details. That’s OK, that’s what I’m here for—clarification.
Again, you should feel free to contact me directly. My phone number is 406-862-1948.
Thanks
Donnie Clapp
PR - Whitefish Mountain Resort
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By Litigation Dictates on Big Mtn on 10-11-07
There’s probably an injury lawsuit of some sort due to the crappy trail down Hellfire. We see the Alert helicopter there every year too.
If the t-bar & 5 trails are closed, shouldn’t that be on yr website? It’s too crowded on weekends and you know it. I’ve been smacked a couple of times by out of control visitors on Sundays. Hell, I got run over by an Ambassador. We just don’t go there on weekends either. Saturday is pure hell w/ bratty rich kids trying to destroy the place.
Donnie, you weren’t here when the boy went missing ‘cause the glades were closed. Many riders go out of bounds along Gray Wolf trying to find some snow.
This poor kid was not found until midnight and nearly lost his life.
The policy of closing terrain because it’s convenient for your corporation endangers others, besides stealing from them.
FRAUD HERE.
VISITORS WARNING: DON"T BELIEVE THE BIG MOUNTAIN’S WEBSITE!
Donnie, you really should give the folks @ Elkland Heights a phonecall.
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By Here's Why on 10-11-07
The new maps will proclaim “Does not run regularly” because of the threat of a class action suit against Winter Sports Inc.
This occured last January when the website conveniently forgot to mention that part of the place was closed. If you don’t believe me call Steve Cummings, your legal counsel.
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By Donnie Clapp on 10-11-07
I feel like you must have had some specific and negative experience with us in the past. If that is the case, I am very sorry and I hope you will contact me and give us a chance to make it right.
That being said, I just want to clarify that we only ever close terrain for two reasons: safety, and events taking place. We don’t run Chairs 4 and 5 because the terrain they service is also served by the brand new Chair 1 and definitely open. We only run T-Bar 2 when we are busy but the terrain it services is generally open to our guests who would like to hike to it.
Thanks,
Donnie
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By Lawyer Lips on 10-12-07
Yes, Donnie, We have all had a specific and negative experience at the Big Mountain. It’s mainly because you won’t open the place up for the ticket buying public, but cannot do enough for the wealthy folk that you are so desperate to attract to your real estate offerings.
You just got through telling us that you must close t-bar 2 to “be frugal with our energy consumption”. Now you only “close terrain for safety or events”. This is a lie. You close 5 trails on weekdays because you are too damn cheap to run the lift.
Now, the terrain that is closed on weekdays may be HIKED to by visitors.
You weren’t at the Big Mountain last year when the ski patrol admitted that they DO NOT SWEEP this terrain at the close of the day. If T-Bar 2 does not operate, the patrol considers this area CLOSED.
You are going to kill someone with this absurdly dangerous policy.
Parents, don’t let your kids go into this unpatrolled terrain, no matter what marketing says!
Beacon Readers Rated This Comment:
By jonboard & family on 10-12-07
We went out to the Big Mountain from Minnesota in January and found that tbar closed. Also, most of the frontside was closed for a race which I am told takes 2 weeks to complete. We were all squeezed along the side of the run occupied by this race, congested, large moguls then bare grass. Only one place to cross the course. Poor planning for sure.
Won’t be back, trying Schweitzer in Idaho this year. Cheaper to fly to Spokane anyway. http://www.schweitzer.com/
Beacon Readers Rated This Comment:
By atleastitshere on 10-12-07
While I’m not the biggest fan of the management of the mountain, nor the evident bowing to higher-paying interests, I am a supporter of having a local ski area. This family has to fly out from Minnesota to get some turns, whereas we have the luxury of a 15-minute drive.
Changes are happening all over the valley spurred by our having been “discovered”...be happy you got here when you did. When the Big gets snow, there’s plenty of terrain to occupy even the dopest shredder- even if s/he has to hike to get her turns. You haters sound like a bunch of whiners.
If you don’t want to ride the Big, don’t buy a ticket (therefore avoiding the liability of getting lost or hurt). My guess is that when it dumps 6+ overnight, you’ll be making the trip up the windy road out your back door because you want to get those sweet, sweet turns. OR, maybe you’ll make the trip to Blacktail, Turner or Schweitzer leaving all the freshies for me and my people. Better yet, throw down for that Colorado ski vacation and pay $75/day to jockey through the crowds.
Here’s to winter’s arrival in the Flathead, and to not having to go very far to enjoy it.
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Let’s be civil. The Flathead Beacon encourages vigorous discussion and lively debate, but we will delete comments that attack other readers, make accusations we can’t verify, stray too far off topic, criticize local businesses (call them if you have a problem), convict someone of a crime, use profanity or are simply judged to be in bad taste. We don’t always have someone moderating comments, so we ask for your help: If you see a comment that violates these ground rules, or you simply deem it offensive, please e-mail editor [at] flatheadbeacon.com. The views expressed in the comments section do not reflect those of the Beacon.
By More Big Mtn BS on 10-06-07
Thank you Donnie for that botanical gem of a fact.
Most outdoors enthusiasts understand the cyclical nature of the xerophyllum, what we call “beargrass”.
They also probable know that there is no correlation between summer blooms and predicted winter precipitation.
Will the Big Mountain be closing part of the terrain on weekdays as they have in past winters?
Will any work ever be done to complete the poorly finished trail down to Chair 11? How about some other trails down there so it’s not so crowded & dangerous trying to dodge trees and other visitors.
If the upper t-bar runs, will some runs be cut down to Chair 7? We’re still waiting.
You guys are too friendly to the potential real estate shoppers. Is this why the private chair is going in for the giant homes down at Elk Highlands? (They always name it after the game they chase away, this is super funny).
By Donnie Clapp on 10-10-07
“Donnie Clapp, spokesman for Whitefish Mountain Resort, said the lore on Big Mountain is that when the bear grass blooms heavily on the slopes, a snowy winter is likely to follow.“
I have to point out that I was no way asserting a fact with this statement, nor do I feel that Mr. Testa implied that in his paraphrasing. This is local folklore, no more, no less. I didn’t make it up, I just think it’s kind of cute.
I’ll answer your other questions here, but I don’t intend to argue back and forth beyond this response. Please email me directly at donniec | at | skiwhitefish | dot | com if you’d like to continue the conversation.
First, Hellroaring Basin. Our development in Hellroaring Basin is very limited because it is protected grizzly bear habitat and extensive clear cutting/re-grading was not and probably never will be approved by the Forest Service in that area. I personally support their position. Plus, Hell Fire is probably my favorite groomer on the mountain. I think there are plenty of runs without trees if that’s what you’re looking for.
Second, T-Bar 2, or the upper T-Bar. No, we probably won’t be cutting runs from the T-Bar down to Chair 7. The main purpose of the T-Bar is to facilitate access to undeveloped tree skiing on the backside. The glades back there are wonderful; you should give them a try. As for opening it every day, not this year, but all depends on demand. We tread a fine line, operating as many lifts as we do with as few skiers as we have. It’s wonderful that we’re uncrowded, but that means we have to be frugal with our energy consumption.
Finally, the Elk Highlands Chair (also known as the Home Again Chair). This chair is not private. The actual equipment was purchased by the company that is developing the Elk Highlands subdivision, but they have contracted with WSI (us) to operate and maintain it. Part of that contract states that any guest on the Big Mountain can use the lift and ski the trails that it serves. These trails are probably not worth skiing for pure recreation, but we wrote that into the contract just to make it clear. So, if you want to go ride it, you should.
Anyway, I really hope that this clears up some misconceptions that it seems you have. Again, let me know if there are any other questions I can answer for you.
Thanks,
Donnie Clapp
PR - Whitefish Mountain Resort
By Still More Big Mtn BS on 10-11-07
Donnie, we’re all anxious to try the glades, but why bother when they are only open on weekends. Have you seen the wild uncontrolled crowds on weekends? We don’t go up there on weekends. There is no speed control other than the occasional ski patroler shouting at snowboarders, it’s just too dangerous up there on weekends.
You guys steal from the skiing public. Make your website say that the place is not entirely open, or offer a weekday rate ticket.
I know you don’t want to discuss this matter here because it exposes the actions of your corporation.
STOP COMMITING FRAUD
Open all of the available terrain.
By Did Something Get Deleted? on 10-11-07
Didn’t the original post above refer to the injuries which occur on the Hellfire Trail because of the large trees in the trail.
What happened to the reference to being personally sickened by the unnecessary injuries caused by this unfinished trail?
Did you delete the part about seeing tears and the Alert helicopter (air ambulance) down at Chair 11 EVERY SINGLE YEAR.
You hurt visitors there every winter.
BTW, I called the gal at Elk Highlands about the private chair and she said that riders that are not homeowners may be denied boarding. Sounds private to me.
By Donnie Clapp on 10-11-07
Just a couple of things:
I’m confused. Are you implying that I somehow have the power to delete parts of posts to the comments section of the Flathead Beacon’s website?
Second, “wild uncontrolled crowds”? On the Big Mountain? I have to assume that this is some sort of joke.
Third, if we have ever implied that T-Bar 2 was open when it wasn’t in the past, I’m sorry. I am fairly confident that if that was ever the case, it was due to oversight, not malice. In any event, we are making an effort this year to be very open about which lifts are open. This season’s trail map actually has “does not operate regularly” printed next to the listings for T-Bar 2, Chair 4, and Chair 5, and our website will reflect this as well.
Fourth, if “the gal at Elk Highlands” really said that, she is wrong. Not everyone knows the details. That’s OK, that’s what I’m here for—clarification.
Again, you should feel free to contact me directly. My phone number is 406-862-1948.
Thanks
Donnie Clapp
PR - Whitefish Mountain Resort
By Litigation Dictates on Big Mtn on 10-11-07
There’s probably an injury lawsuit of some sort due to the crappy trail down Hellfire. We see the Alert helicopter there every year too.
If the t-bar & 5 trails are closed, shouldn’t that be on yr website? It’s too crowded on weekends and you know it. I’ve been smacked a couple of times by out of control visitors on Sundays. Hell, I got run over by an Ambassador. We just don’t go there on weekends either. Saturday is pure hell w/ bratty rich kids trying to destroy the place.
Donnie, you weren’t here when the boy went missing ‘cause the glades were closed. Many riders go out of bounds along Gray Wolf trying to find some snow.
This poor kid was not found until midnight and nearly lost his life.
The policy of closing terrain because it’s convenient for your corporation endangers others, besides stealing from them.
FRAUD HERE.
VISITORS WARNING: DON"T BELIEVE THE BIG MOUNTAIN’S WEBSITE!
Donnie, you really should give the folks @ Elkland Heights a phonecall.
By Here's Why on 10-11-07
The new maps will proclaim “Does not run regularly” because of the threat of a class action suit against Winter Sports Inc.
This occured last January when the website conveniently forgot to mention that part of the place was closed. If you don’t believe me call Steve Cummings, your legal counsel.
By Donnie Clapp on 10-11-07
I feel like you must have had some specific and negative experience with us in the past. If that is the case, I am very sorry and I hope you will contact me and give us a chance to make it right.
That being said, I just want to clarify that we only ever close terrain for two reasons: safety, and events taking place. We don’t run Chairs 4 and 5 because the terrain they service is also served by the brand new Chair 1 and definitely open. We only run T-Bar 2 when we are busy but the terrain it services is generally open to our guests who would like to hike to it.
Thanks,
Donnie
By Lawyer Lips on 10-12-07
Yes, Donnie, We have all had a specific and negative experience at the Big Mountain. It’s mainly because you won’t open the place up for the ticket buying public, but cannot do enough for the wealthy folk that you are so desperate to attract to your real estate offerings.
You just got through telling us that you must close t-bar 2 to “be frugal with our energy consumption”. Now you only “close terrain for safety or events”. This is a lie. You close 5 trails on weekdays because you are too damn cheap to run the lift.
Now, the terrain that is closed on weekdays may be HIKED to by visitors.
You weren’t at the Big Mountain last year when the ski patrol admitted that they DO NOT SWEEP this terrain at the close of the day. If T-Bar 2 does not operate, the patrol considers this area CLOSED.
You are going to kill someone with this absurdly dangerous policy.
Parents, don’t let your kids go into this unpatrolled terrain, no matter what marketing says!
By jonboard & family on 10-12-07
We went out to the Big Mountain from Minnesota in January and found that tbar closed. Also, most of the frontside was closed for a race which I am told takes 2 weeks to complete. We were all squeezed along the side of the run occupied by this race, congested, large moguls then bare grass. Only one place to cross the course. Poor planning for sure.
Won’t be back, trying Schweitzer in Idaho this year. Cheaper to fly to Spokane anyway. http://www.schweitzer.com/
By atleastitshere on 10-12-07
While I’m not the biggest fan of the management of the mountain, nor the evident bowing to higher-paying interests, I am a supporter of having a local ski area. This family has to fly out from Minnesota to get some turns, whereas we have the luxury of a 15-minute drive.
Changes are happening all over the valley spurred by our having been “discovered”...be happy you got here when you did. When the Big gets snow, there’s plenty of terrain to occupy even the dopest shredder- even if s/he has to hike to get her turns. You haters sound like a bunch of whiners.
If you don’t want to ride the Big, don’t buy a ticket (therefore avoiding the liability of getting lost or hurt). My guess is that when it dumps 6+ overnight, you’ll be making the trip up the windy road out your back door because you want to get those sweet, sweet turns. OR, maybe you’ll make the trip to Blacktail, Turner or Schweitzer leaving all the freshies for me and my people. Better yet, throw down for that Colorado ski vacation and pay $75/day to jockey through the crowds.
Here’s to winter’s arrival in the Flathead, and to not having to go very far to enjoy it.